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 Vietnam, Chelidonium: cinctum
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BillTyson
Member Rosenbergia

USA
1200 Posts

Posted - 24/10/2016 :  19:13:46  Show Profile  Email Poster  Reply with Quote

45.36 KB

Lam Dong, Bao Lam, Da Ton, May, 22 mm

Andre
Member Rosenbergia

Germany
1694 Posts

Posted - 25/10/2016 :  06:59:45  Show Profile  Email Poster  Reply with Quote
Chelidonium, nahe venereum T.
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BillTyson
Member Rosenbergia

USA
1200 Posts

Posted - 25/10/2016 :  21:03:40  Show Profile  Email Poster  Reply with Quote
Sure looks like it but rather south of its know range.
Many thanks
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Francesco
Forum Admin

Luxembourg
9454 Posts

Posted - 07/02/2019 :  19:28:48  Show Profile  Email Poster  Visit Francesco's Homepage  Reply with Quote
According to Bentanachs & Jiroux (2019), Chelidonium cinctum (Guérin-Menéville, 1844) = Chelidonium venereum Thomson, 1865.
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Andre
Member Rosenbergia

Germany
1694 Posts

Posted - 08/02/2019 :  10:33:16  Show Profile  Email Poster  Reply with Quote
Hello Francesco
Have you a pdf for me
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Francesco
Forum Admin

Luxembourg
9454 Posts

Posted - 08/02/2019 :  13:14:16  Show Profile  Email Poster  Visit Francesco's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Ich habe leider kein PDF gekriegt, nur das Heft.
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Andre
Member Rosenbergia

Germany
1694 Posts

Posted - 20/02/2019 :  11:26:52  Show Profile  Email Poster  Reply with Quote
Für mich ist die Synonymie von Chelidonium venereum mit C. cinctum nicht geklärt. C. cinctum ist aus S - Indien beschrieben.... C. venereum aus Kambotscha. Da liegen bestimmt 3000 km dazwischen. Ich konnte 2 Ex. dieser Gruppe aus S - Indien untersuchen. Beide Ex. weisen Unterschiede zu den bisher 75 Ex. aus Laos, Myanmar, Thailand und China auf. Die Zeichnung dieser Tiere kann von dem vollständig ausgebildeten Makel bis zur Reduktion auf 2 gelbe Spots, oder bis complett ohne Spot sein. Dann ähnelt die Art sehr dem Chelidonium argentatum und ist von ihr meiner Meinung nach nur durch die genitalmorphologische Untersuchung sicher zu trennen. Um ein Synonym vorzuschlagen, sollte meiner Meinung nach wenigstens das untersuchte Material aufgeführt sein.
Wurden denn Exemplare aus Indien untersucht ???
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Xavier
Scientific Collaborator

France
12205 Posts

Posted - 20/02/2019 :  12:20:03  Show Profile  Email Poster  Reply with Quote
Translation in English:
For me the synonymy of Chelidonium venereum with C. cinctum is not clarified. C. cinctum is described from S - India.... C. venereum from Cambodia. There are exactly 3000 km in between. I could examine 2 ex. of this group from S - India. Both ex. show differences with the 75 ex. from Laos, Myanmar, Thailand and China. The drawing of these animals can be from the fully developed spot to the reduction to 2 yellow spots, or to completely without spot. Then the species is very similar to Chelidonium argentatum and in my opinion, it can only be separated from it by genital morphology. In order to suggest a synonym, at least the examined material should be listed in my opinion.
Have specimens from India been examined?

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator
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Francesco
Forum Admin

Luxembourg
9454 Posts

Posted - 27/02/2019 :  18:20:01  Show Profile  Email Poster  Visit Francesco's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Andre

Wurden denn Exemplare aus Indien untersucht ???
Wie für andere untersuchte Arten, zitiert der Artikel kein Material, sondern vorstellt die Photos der Holotypen von Chelidonium venereum Thomson, Leontium binotatum Brongniar und Chelidonium binotatum var. uninotatum Pic.
Callichroma cincta Guérin-Menéville fehlt.
Ein Aedeagus ist vorgestellt aber das ist unklar, von welchem Tier er kommt.
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Andre
Member Rosenbergia

Germany
1694 Posts

Posted - 26/11/2021 :  08:58:53  Show Profile  Email Poster  Reply with Quote
It is Chelidonium venereum Thomson, 1865, see Skale, 2021
Chelidonium cinctum (Guerin-Meneville, 1844) is for me Endemic to India.
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